so, how was it today?

[highpeaksdrifter]

Web cam shows tracks on Lower Valley.

Guess it's open.

[Harvey44]

Nice report Harv.

Thanks HPD.

Hey I have a question that probably isn't worth a separate thread:

What the vertical rise of the Little Face Chair?

I couldn't figure it out from the map.

[takeahike46er]

It's 1555'. All of the lift verticals are listed on the .pdf trail map.

[nyspnypd]

Web cam shows tracks on Lower Valley.

Guess it's open.

Yeah its open I saw people skiing down it but on the conditions list it says closed.

[evantrentful]

I think theres alot of miss on whats happening with terrain parks. They are catering to a new generation. While they may not have the same money power yet, the reality is they will get older, they will have jobs they will start families and they will have that buying power down the line. They have to start looking to the future if they want to sustain a business long term. It was like the 80's when snowboarding was shunned, and in the latter part of the 90's its growth exploded, creating a new drive in younger population groups that much of the industry can be thankful for. Racing brought alot of attention to skiing, as do these terrain parks. Go to Whiteface midweek and more than half visitors are young adults, college kids, etc blasting around, who want terrain parks.

[ComeBackMudPuddles]

too bad as much attention wasn't spent on mogul fields mid-season....groomers and parks are nice, but some solid bump runs wouldn't hurt.

[zski]

these posts that talk about the terrain park folks as the future of the sport are missing a key point. These kids when they grow up and become adults will not be able to keep abusing their bodies in the park. the snow sports industry needs to create true life long participants. Unless these kids learn to love skiing for the turning then they will drop out when their bodies can't any longer cash the checks the park deals out. the local orthopedists and dentists love the park for all the extra business it doles out. One of them i talked to even joked that they should advertise in the park so when the park rats invariably smash their teeth in or break their shins on a rail they now where to go.

parks are not a long term solution - they are a temporary fad like free style skiing was in the 1970's. my guess is that if you are reading this 99% of you are a life long skier / boarder. How many park fans will still be in the sport after their 20's? Not many - just one more data point in the theory that parks are not economically viable long term for the snow sports industry

[evantrentful]

Its not necessarily the future of the sport, but a gateway to lure a new generation onto the mountains. Terrain Parks have only existed in prominence for about a decade now and given its continued growth I dont think its near its peak yet. Especially with the freeskiing movement really gaining traction you could see it explode even further. I think you could see fit guys (and girls!) easily running into their mid 30's still running through the parks without to much of a problem. Sure they might not be doing what they could in their early 20's but needless to say that goes for just about everything we do. Im 23 now and have been skiing park for 6 years, and I feel just as good as I did back then. The ones that push themselves to hard and to far are ones they end up being taken down by ski patrol. I understand your Park Rats comment, but remember people grow up and they learn to appreciate things more. Ive skiied with guys that you would most definitely consider park rats (not nesscarily assholes but they lapped parks all day long), but as we have gottin older we just love cruising around the mountains. At the same time though I cant imagine not having the parks.

[ilovesnow]

these posts that talk about the terrain park folks as the future of the sport are missing a key point. These kids when they grow up and become adults will not be able to keep abusing their bodies in the park. the snow sports industry needs to create true life long participants. Unless these kids learn to love skiing for the turning then they will drop out when their bodies can't any longer cash the checks the park deals out. the local orthopedists and dentists love the park for all the extra business it doles out. One of them i talked to even joked that they should advertise in the park so when the park rats invariably smash their teeth in or break their shins on a rail they now where to go.

parks are not a long term solution - they are a temporary fad like free style skiing was in the 1970's. my guess is that if you are reading this 99% of you are a life long skier / boarder. How many park fans will still be in the sport after their 20's? Not many - just one more data point in the theory that parks are not economically viable long term for the snow sports industry

Are u for real...temporary fad? Come on! I am as big a die hard skiier as any (85+ days a year), but lets put it this way, if it wasn't for terrain parks, half pipes and snowboarders there would be half as many ski areas still in business. Resorts need terrain parks.
Skier visits were dropping like a rock threw the 80's and 90's, once snowboarding was allowed at resorts numbers started to increase. Clothing trends changed and twin tip skis were born and the ski industry started to grow again.
We should be accepting of all forms of skiing and snowboarding for the sake of our sport.

Buy the way i know a couple of guys in there 30's that not only ski in the park every day they are x racers who kill it in skiercross.

[zski]

Here is a little simple financial anaysis of the terrian park. I've heard that the park budget was north of $500,000 - to cover the extra snow, extra grooming time building the features, staff, liability for injuries, higher insurance etc. Let's say that will the large addition of broadway the park budget is $600k. At $74 a day for lift tickets that means you have to sell over 8100 more lift tickets just to break even on cash flow.

the proper way to do this would be to really look at the extra profit that the park brings in. Since we don't know WF's margin lets just say its 25%. In that case WF would have to sell over 24,000 more lift tickets to justify the terriain park. I don't the park supports any where near that. That means that the park has to sell about 200 lift tickets more every single day WF is open - there is no way in heck that is the case. During the week you'd be hard pressed to sell 10 -20 more tickets becasue of the park meaning you have to sell in the thousands more on the weekends. The taxpayers of the State of NY are subsidizing the park folk hoping onto metal rails and logs and knocking their teeth out and given the financial crisis the state is in its only a matter of time it will come to an end